Weights Training in TKD

Discussion in 'Health & Fitness' started by bowlie, Oct 25, 2012.

  1. bowlie

    bowlie Well-Known Member

    Hi, I was wondering what everyone thought of weights training in Taekwondo.

    Firstly, let me clarify what i mean by weight lifting. The kind of weights i do are low vollume, high intensity movements such as heavy squats, heavy deadlifts e.c.t. This is geared towards maximal strength and power development, rather than size, like a bodybuilder would. I am not getting bigger, just stronger.

    I was wondering what kind of experience people have with this kind of training. I have done various martial arts over the years, and i find that when i did BJJ strength training was very highly regarded. When i did boxing, it was less so, but the people that did it where also the strongest hitters. In TKD, people seem to be reluctant towards it. There is one guy i train with that works out like a bodybuilder and is huge, but not particularly explosive, so im wondering if this is why people seem to think it doesnt help.
     
    Gabriel M.M likes this.
  2. Narcsarge

    Narcsarge New Member

    Great question. I've trained for power (heavy lifting like a power lifter) as part of my normal lifting routine. Variety for muscle confusion and continued growth. Weight training is just fine for Martial Arts and TKD is no exception. Weight training will help develop power, stability, and protect against injury. Combine that with the stretching and cardio aspects of TKD and, I believe, you have a great routine. If you weight train so much you lose flexibility or inhibit your range of motion (R.O.M.) then you might want to reassess your training. You don't think those old monks and priests carried logs, water, and sand bags for fun do you? [​IMG]
     
    Gabriel M.M likes this.
  3. bowlie

    bowlie Well-Known Member

    Thanks for the reply. What kind of strength levels did you find to be beneficial, and where there any exercises you found particular useful or useless? For example strength and conditioning coach Steve Maxwell thinks that pistol squats are better than back squats for athletic performance, if not for general size / strength gains. I was wondering if you had a similar experience?
     
  4. Kieran Black

    Kieran Black New Member

    I don't bother, if your upper body gets too big it can throw off your centre of balance.
     
  5. Narcsarge

    Narcsarge New Member

    I don't understand your question "What kind of strength levels did you find to be beneficial..." The "big 3" (Squats, Deads, and Bench) were all great when training for power. If you're training for power (heavy weight, low reps, high intensity) you'd better be eating to feed those workouts so I don't see how you aren't gaining size and weight unless your diet is off. Useless exercises.... YES! Lat pullovers, leg extensions, hamstring curls, calf raises, behind the neck presses, good mornings. Not saying you CAN'T do these to shake up a routine but for power and strength I think they are useless. You seem to be combining conditioning training (pistol squats) with power training (back squats). Both have there place in a well rounded training regimen so I am not sure which way your training is headed. @ Kieran; I agree with your statement about training upper body only but I think weight training is a great compliment to any Martial Art training.
     
  6. bowlie

    bowlie Well-Known Member

    Well as a muscle gets stronger, it also uses more energy, so I was wondering if you noticed any extra strain on your conditioning at your highest strength levels. I was also wondering if you saw big improvements in power going up to point X and then saw diminishing returns. I imagine the impact of going from 60KG squat to 100KG would be greater than going from 100KG to 140KG. As for my diet, at the minute im content to gain size, but soon that wont be the case. As for pistols, are we talking about the one legged squats? for me these count as strength exercises as I cant do many at all. If you can do these long enough they count as conditioning then well done. My conditioning at the minute is just basic low intensity cardio aimed at reducing my heart rate.

    This was my planned program, how does it look?

    Push 1

    Squats
    Pistols
    Bench Press
    DB Bench Press

    Pull 1

    Deadlifts
    Single stiff legged deadlifts
    Pullups
    Latt pulldowns (may swap these if you think they didnt help an awful lot)

    Push 2

    Squats
    Split Squats
    Military Press
    DB Military Press

    Pull 2

    Deadlifts
    Lunges
    Bent over rows
    DB Rows

    I had shoulder surgery a few months ago, so I want to make sure I dont develop any imbalances, so there is a heavy emphasis on unilateral movements as assistance lifts to the main ones. I would do the workouts in this order 3 days a week. I was planning to do 5 reps of each main movement (squats, bench, pullups e.c.t.) up to about my 5 rep max (so keep adding weight until I fail the set before 5 reps) and then do 4 sets of 8 reps on the assistance movements? What feedback can you give on this? thanks, Josh
     
  7. Narcsarge

    Narcsarge New Member

    When you first start a power training cycle you will see a quick response for a while and then, yes, you will plateau. It happens in all routines including Martial Arts Training. You'll get bigger, stronger, and more power as long as your diet is suited to that training. Heavy trucks have poor gas mileage. Same with your muscle growth. Bigger muscles need more calories more often. If your training heavy, 5 sets is really too high. One warmup set and 3 progressively heavier sets. Your 3rd set could be to failure and then assisted. There are tons of weightlifting forums online (I've been on just about all of them) where you can learn a ton of information about the different types of training splits.




    Push 1

    Squats
    Pistols (My opinion, do either squats OR pistols; not both)
    Bench Press
    DB Bench Press (again, do either DB's or Bench not both)

    (I'd add Military presses to any PUSH training. I'd also give leg training it's own day unless you are a total beginner in the weight room)

    Pull 1

    Deadlifts
    Single stiff legged deadlifts (do Deads or stiff Deads, not both)
    Pullups
    Latt pulldowns (may swap these if you think they didnt help an awful lot) (do Pullups or lat pulldowns, not both)

    Push 2

    Squats
    Split Squats
    Military Press
    DB Military Press

    Again, do one type of squat and one pressing exercise. If you are lifting HEAVY, it's been my experience, less is more! Same for Pull 2:

    Deadlifts
    Lunges
    Bent over rows
    DB Rows
     
  8. Master Fahy

    Master Fahy Active Member

    You should look into Plyometric exercises to help develop strength as well as doing weight training. Master Fahy
     
  9. bowlie

    bowlie Well-Known Member

    I was always told to build a decent strength base before plyo's to reduce the risk of injury doing them. How would you test to see if your strong enough?
     
  10. Master Fahy

    Master Fahy Active Member

    Plyometric's will bring out your strength as you do them! Master Fahy
     
    John McNally likes this.
  11. Nathaniel Flamm

    Nathaniel Flamm New Member

    I don't think it's necessary but it might help with speed and power if you're lacking...
     
  12. Pledge

    Pledge New Member

    I think there is no any weight training in TKD as bodybuilding.
    I never did any weight training in TKD but only some high intensity workouts to control the body weight and maintain the fitness.
     
  13. Gethin Rhys James

    Gethin Rhys James New Member

    I've placed a post to my forum. icankeepup's blogspot page has a lot of information on speed development and weight training.
     
  14. canadiankyosa

    canadiankyosa Active Member

    Much good reading here. My basic take:

    Strength does not equate power. They are as separate as engine and motor. If you lift faster (one equally with slow) with light weight with higher reps, you will benefit more. More muscle mass means more energy required and the slower, I think, you will be. Power equals acceleration x distance. Simple algebraic formula: increase mass, acceleration decreases and therefore time increases. Take Bruce Lee. He had a rear straight punch that travelled at 1/100 of a second and could knock a man, weighing almost twice his (280 pds), back about 12 feet. He goes to show that mass is not required but useable power is. Answer: train for power overall and not for strength.
     

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