when to teach pattern application in chang hon forms ?

Discussion in 'Taekwondo Patterns' started by michael mckenna, Apr 12, 2014.

  1. michael mckenna

    michael mckenna Active Member

    hey all not been on here for awhile was very busy doing different things.

    so i got stuart anslow's book practical applications to the chang hon forms voulume 1. loved the book really an eye opener and just thought it would be good to know when should applications be taught should it be taught for example white belt learns saju makgi and saju jirugi and gets taught the applications at yellow belt and so on or should they be taught to the higher grades from blue belt to 1st dan ? i feel early as possible would be good but it was mentioned doing this very early leaves out imagination for the student for what each move is for. i feel applications for patterns should be taught after the student has graded for that pattern like i said saju jirgu and saju makgi applications can be taught at yellow belt chon ji at green stripe dan gun at green belt do san at blue stripe and you can pretty much see where i am going with this.

    any thoughts would be great
  2. John Hulslander

    John Hulslander Active Member

    Seems to me knowing the context of the move has an effect on how the practitioner performs the move.
    Some are relatively evident. Punches, kicks, some of the blocks. Some are not.
  3. Gnarlie

    Gnarlie Well-Known Member

    During the journey, the destination seems important. When the destination is reached, the importance of the journey is realised.

    Applications are one of many possible destinations. The journey to finding out / creating / researching / developing applications is where the value lies. For that reason, there's part of me that want to say applications should not be directly taught at all. Realistically, I think it's enough to show a few examples and teach principles for understanding and interpreting forms and let people think for themselves.

    I don't believe in spoon-feeding people but I do think it's helpful to show them where the spoons are.
  4. canadiankyosa

    canadiankyosa Active Member

    I agree. Part of the training is the student thinking about the applications. To use the Japanese word, bunkai is more of an interpretation than a given. Instructors tend to tell the student "this is how it is" and not allow them to envision for themselves what it may be.
    John Hulslander likes this.
  5. michael mckenna

    michael mckenna Active Member

    very well said sir, my instructor shows us some applications that he has found and we have to find applications as part of home work and demonstrate it in the class to the instructor, i would probably show them examples also for each technique and tell them to find more on there own
  6. Finlay

    Finlay Active Member

    Tradioanlly in some chinese style the order was actually the other way round, people would learn skills then learn the forms after they reached a certainlevel were taught forms. this is why in some style forms were seen as special knoledge. not like today where they are basically bought from the instructor

    Also in China, there is a Confucian teaching philosophy. I can't remeber the exact quote but is is something like : the teacher gives 3 corners of the square to the student, if the student can't work out the 4th corner then they aren't worth teaching.
    michael mckenna and Gnarlie like this.
  7. Gnarlie

    Gnarlie Well-Known Member

    I agree. You have to find a large part of Taekwondo for yourself. Coincidentally, it's the bit most worth having.
  8. david.kernan3

    david.kernan3 New Member

    Hi I've got Stuart anslows book to it's a great book even tho I do tagb taekwondo which teaches the same patterns the itf also teaches it doesn't teach the techniques mentioned in the book so it's helped me open my eyes to various other techniques which can also be used not mentioned in the book

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